C2 Ball Joints

[Jim R.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Hi Mark, my 65 has moog lowers riveted, there was no point loss when my car was judged.

[Gary B.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Hi Mark, my 65 has moog lowers riveted, there was no point loss when my car was judged.

Jim,

Was the judging done at a Chapter, Regional or National meet?

A common difference between original and 3rd party ball joints is the unthreaded, smaller diameter nose on the threaded stud. If the Moog ball joints don't have that feature, most observant and knowledgeable judges will take a deduct, so you might simply have lucked out if you got by with no deduct.

Gary

[Patrick H.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Jim,

Was the judging done at a Chapter, Regional or National meet?

A common difference between original and 3rd party ball joints is the unthreaded, smaller diameter nose on the threaded stud. If the Moog ball joints don't have that feature, most observant and knowledgeable judges will take a deduct, so you might simply have lucked out if you got by with no deduct.

Gary

Or, like in 70-72, there are 4 points for Originality under "Upper and Lower Ball Joints." That gives you 1 point per joint and there are 5 axes to judge (CDCIF). Aftermarket joints that are riveted in place and only the lowers replaced - really worth 1 point deduction in the overall scheme of things?

Yes, I had this happen this weekend.

Patrick

[Jim R.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Gary here are the ones i had riveted. (chapter)

[Gary B.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Or, like in 70-72, there are 4 points for Originality under "Upper and Lower Ball Joints." That gives you 1 point per joint and there are 5 axes to judge (CDCIF). Aftermarket joints that are riveted in place and only the lowers replaced - really worth 1 point deduction in the overall scheme of things?

Yes, I had this happen this weekend.

Patrick

Patrick,

I agree it doesn't make sense when you consider total points and items in that category and when you break it down according to CDCIF. But I bet we've all see a 1 point deduct happen in just the situation you describe.

Gary

[Joe L.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Or, like in 70-72, there are 4 points for Originality under "Upper and Lower Ball Joints." That gives you 1 point per joint and there are 5 axes to judge (CDCIF). Aftermarket joints that are riveted in place and only the lowers replaced - really worth 1 point deduction in the overall scheme of things?

Yes, I had this happen this weekend.

Patrick

Patrick-----


I TOTALLY agree. In actuality the difference in configuration should be about 0.1 point. Since you can't assign a fractional point deduction, I say assign no deduction.

[Patrick H.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

Patrick,

I agree it doesn't make sense when you consider total points and items in that category and when you break it down according to CDCIF. But I bet we've all see a 1 point deduct happen in just the situation you describe.

Gary

Yep.

I did take 1 point when they were bolted in place. There are plenty of times a 20% deduction doesn't warrant a 33% deduction in points, or something similar (1 point of 3 assigned, for example).

[John H.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints; points deduction

John,

I interpret the '66 TIM&JG and judging sheets differently than you do. If you look in the '66 TIM&JG there is no mention whatsoever of ball joints in Item 3, "Upper A arms & shock attachment". Whereas in the item 7, "Ball joints & Hardware" the TIM&JG states "both upper & lower ball joints are a natural finish ...". From which I conclude the judging points for both upper and lower ball joint are only part of item 7.

Now this might vary among the C2 TIM&JGs. But as far as '66 is concerned, I'd judge all ball joints in item 7, based on the '66 TIM&JG description.

Gary

Gary -

I was referring to the judging sheet line items, not the item number in the TIM&JG. The uppers are covered in Item #3 (Engine Compartment) on the Chassis Judging Sheet, and the lowers are covered in Item #7 (Front Suspension); that's where the line items are for scoring and tabulating.

[Joe R.]

Re: C2 Ball Joints

How do you know when your ball joints need to be replaced ?

Is it typically the lowers that need replacing ?

Does America's Finest make the closest reproduction ?

Anyone having issues with repro ball joints failing ?

Two mechanics told me they have heard of repro ball joints failing in just 1,000 miles or do and both told me to go with MOOG ball joints annd take the deduction.


What would be the total deduction if I bolted in MOOG ball joints for upper and lower ?

What would be the total deduction if I correctly riveted MOOG ball joints for upper and lower ?

Hi Mark:

I'm just catching up on the TDB postings, but I thought I would add a few comments to what the other responders said:

1) The AFC parts look very nice and should get full credit in judging. My *impression* is that AFC's owner Michael is particular about quality and is likely to be using a good quality manufacturer.

2) That being said, ball joints are a significant safety-related part. Actual breakage or separation of a ball joint with the car at speed would have major consequences. Since I sometimes drive my car in a "spirited" fashion, I decided that I would only consider OEM GM parts or Moog replacements for my own car. This is probably an ultra-conservative view, but it is the choice I made for my particular situation.

3) I agree with the other posters that the point deduction for replacement style ball joints is in the range of one or two points.

4) The ball joints used on midyear Corvettes were the same ones used on passenger cars, so quite a few were made for service. They still show up at places like Carlisle and ebay. I bought a complete set at Carlisle a couple years ago for $500. This was how I chose to resolve the originality-versus-safety debate for my own situation. Other solutions would probably be better for some people, but this turned out to be the best choice for me.