Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

[Kirk M.]

Here are some pics of the engine compartment of my 327/300hp with PS, PB, and AC. Give me your best NCRS critique! Thanks.

[Joe C.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Body: St. Louis or Smith?

1. No rectangular tabs visible along tops of exhaust manifolds.
2. Hood latches appear to be painted silver.
3. Overspray missing from exhaust manifolds.
4. Hood latch return springs should be black oxide.
5. Fan clutch appears to be a replacement.
6. Spring clamps on refrigerant lines.
7. The hood latches and connecting cable were all installed together. If body by Smith, then all three would show no blackout. If body St.Louis, then all three would show (varying degrees of) overspray.
8. Proportioning valve should be unpainted brass.
9. Brake lines should be natural steel.
10. Overflow hose pinched/kinked.
11. Rain gutters high gloss.

[Tom H.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Hi Kirk !

Your detail job looks very nice. Pretty brave of you to put your work out here for us to crutique !! Some of us are pretty tough.

One of the goals many of us strive for are not only a high level of detail, but to recreate the way the cars left the plant. Sometimes not as pretty as we might have imagined !

If you don't have one, get a judging guide for your car and you can do some of your own judging, and make changes accordingly based on your intented use of the car. ( Driving, showing, etc. )

Nice job.

[Kirk M.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Body: St. Louis or Smith?

1. No rectangular tabs visible along tops of exhaust manifolds.
2. Hood latches appear to be painted silver.
3. Overspray missing from exhaust manifolds.
4. Hood latch return springs should be black oxide.
5. Fan clutch appears to be a replacement.
6. Spring clamps on refrigerant lines.
7. The hood latches and connecting cable were all installed together. If body by Smith, then all three would show no blackout. If body St.Louis, then all three would show (varying degrees of) overspray.
8. Proportioning valve should be unpainted brass.
9. Brake lines should be natural steel.
10. Overflow hose pinched/kinked.
11. Rain gutters high gloss.

Opps. Forgot that that would be inportant. A.O. Smith body.

[Kirk M.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Hi Kirk !

Your detail job looks very nice. Pretty brave of you to put your work out here for us to crutique !! Some of us are pretty tough.

One of the goals many of us strive for are not only a high level of detail, but to recreate the way the cars left the plant. Sometimes not as pretty as we might have imagined !

If you don't have one, get a judging guide for your car and you can do some of your own judging, and make changes accordingly based on your intented use of the car. ( Driving, showing, etc. )

Nice job.

Got the book. Highlighted, underlined, dog-eared and starting to show some grime. That's what I've been using the past couple of years to get the car back into "fighting trim". First and foremost, I drive my car, but I like the idea of having everything original, so have been slowly working toward getting the car judged. I think, if everything works out, I should get judged in August at a local chapter meet here in Columbus. I'm just trying to get some of those "intangibles" answered with this post. Thanks for the words of encouragement.

[Joseph T.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Kirk,
Extremely brave! I took a quick look.
-Your clamps look correct for the refrigerant hoses, What are the manuf. Stamp on the body?
In 1967 there was no orange overspray on the exhaust manifolds.
-Are those gaskets I see under the exhaust manifolds?
-No plug in the top of a 327/300 waterpump for bypass.only on 327/350 cars.
Good Luck I will check closer later.

[Kirk M.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Body: St. Louis or Smith?

1. No rectangular tabs visible along tops of exhaust manifolds.
2. Hood latches appear to be painted silver.
3. Overspray missing from exhaust manifolds.
4. Hood latch return springs should be black oxide.
5. Fan clutch appears to be a replacement.
6. Spring clamps on refrigerant lines.
7. The hood latches and connecting cable were all installed together. If body by Smith, then all three would show no blackout. If body St.Louis, then all three would show (varying degrees of) overspray.
8. Proportioning valve should be unpainted brass.
9. Brake lines should be natural steel.
10. Overflow hose pinched/kinked.
11. Rain gutters high gloss.

Thanks Joe. Just what I wanted. I hope you don't mind helping me go through these one by one.

1. What rectangular tabs would those be? Looking at the JG, are you referring to the tabs from the French locks on the end pair of manifold bolts?

2. They may be, although the flash of the camera makes them look better than they really do. They are the way they came with car when I bought it. I see from the JG they should be cadmium or zinc plated. Just assumed they were, but I will check.

3.Overspray missing from manifolds. Don't see that one in the JG, so do I assume it would be engine orange in my case? How much is expected?

4. Will see if they are painted as suggested in 2. Will order new ones of the proper make in needed. Can you "black phosphate" something?

5. Totally agree with that one cause I had to replace the fan that was on the car, a seven blade, with a five. Maybe one day I'll pick a correct one up and replace it.

6. I was pretty sure I had all the clamps correct on the AC system since I restored all the lines last year. Which ones are you referring to exactly, so that I can double-check.

7. A.O. Smith, so no blackout.

8. Just re-did the whole MC and booster (it too was painted black). I will see if I can clean off the black paint. Hopefully, it is brass underneath. If not does someone make a good replacement part?

9. By brake lines do you mean the ones running to and out of the proportioning valve? If so, I should be able to clean those up too.

10. Replaced that last year with the proper hose and it kinks. Not sure what to do as I have tried moving it around but it wants to stay kinked.

11. Help me out here - are the rain gutters the white pained "troughs" that run around the engine compartment area. I have be faithfully waxing them along with the rest of the car. So, are they suppose to be white, but not waxed and glossy?

Sorry, for all the follow-ups. But I really appreciate the help.

Kirk

[Kirk M.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Kirk,
Extremely brave! I took a quick look.
-Your clamps look correct for the refrigerant hoses, What are the manuf. Stamp on the body?
In 1967 there was no orange overspray on the exhaust manifolds.
-Are those gaskets I see under the exhaust manifolds?
-No plug in the top of a 327/300 waterpump for bypass.only on 327/350 cars.
Good Luck I will check closer later.

The refrigerant hose clamps have the proper Murray stamps on them. They appeared original to the system to me before I changed out all of the old hoses.

Ok, no overspray. One item down.

No, no gaskets. Just some shaddowing and dirt.

Water pump must not be the correct pump then. That was obviously on the car when I got it and will eventually have to be replaced if incorrect.

Thanks a bunch! Keep looking!

Kirk

[Joseph T.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Kirk, A couple more items I noticed. By the way, the engine compartment is very nice. There are alot of items to address with the number of options on your car, so don't get discouraged.Keep up the good detail work.
- Bolts securing the thermostat housing should be orange.
- upper contro arm locking nuts should not be painted black oor the shims.
Any more questions, post some additional pictures. Good Luck.

[Gerard F.]

A Man after my Own Heart

Kirk,

Looks great. I have a 67/327/300Hp (Vin 22049,also AO Smith body) but without original AC/PB/PS. I've had my car for 39 years as a driver and have been restoring it. Have made nearly 100% on the engine detailing.

Your engine looks a lot like mine. Get it judged at a Chapter meet and then go from there.

Here's my comments, which may differ from comments above:

1. Not sure there was any overspray on the exhaust mainifolds, mine didn't have any.

2. Get the decals for the passenger side valve cover, "HE" (one piece) on the rear surface, "Built by the No.1 Team Chevrolet" on the forward surface.

3. Although the JG says French Locks on the exhaust manifold bolts, mine never had any. I have the shoulder type later bolts to prove it. My exhaust manifolds have never been off.

4. If you think something is original and varies with the JG, leave it as is or refinish it the way you found it.

Would like to see a picture of your 3810 without the air cleaner assembly on. Here's my engine, lot of things incorrect, except for the carb:



Don't look at the unpainted valve cover bolts, wrong PCV hose (presently changed) and the Vintage Air compressor and pulleys (which I will never change).

Hope to meet you at one of the meets.

[Kirk M.]

Re: A Man after my Own Heart

Kirk,

Looks great. I have a 67/327/300Hp (Vin 22049,also AO Smith body) but without original AC/PB/PS. I've had my car for 39 years as a driver and have been restoring it. Have made nearly 100% on the engine detailing.

Your engine looks a lot like mine. Get it judged at a Chapter meet and then go from there.

Here's my comments, which may differ from comments above:

1. Not sure there was any overspray on the exhaust mainifolds, mine didn't have any.

2. Get the decals for the passenger side valve cover, "HE" (one piece) on the rear surface, "Built by the No.1 Team Chevrolet" on the forward surface.

3. Although the JG says French Locks on the exhaust manifold bolts, mine never had any. I have the shoulder type later bolts to prove it. My exhaust manifolds have never been off.

4. If you think something is original and varies with the JG, leave it as is or refinish it the way you found it.

Would like to see a picture of your 3810 without the air cleaner assembly on. Here's my engine, lot of things incorrect, except for the carb:



Don't look at the unpainted valve cover bolts, wrong PCV hose (presently changed) and the Vintage Air compressor and pulleys (which I will never change).

Hope to meet you at one of the meets.

Thanks Jerry. Always good to get feedback from someone who has a similar car. I will take a picture of the carb for you today (I just happen to be home) and post later. Already got the stickers on, you just can't see them and in my case it would be "HO" since I have an automatic, or Drs. wife vette. Only good thing about that is Drs. wives tended not to modify their rides much, which might explain so many original parts and options. I too still have many things to work on, but it's coming along. Hope to meet ya some time in the future too.

Kirk

[Joe C.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Kirk,

That's a great looking engine compartment, and better my being frank with you now, than the bozo on the judging field!

Here's the way your setup should look:




Notice the SHP alternator bracket, and high impact yellow paint.



I stand corrected on the exhaust manifold overspray, and the refrigerant hose clamps (items 3 and 6).

Point1: ".........have seven rectangular projections (1/8" x 1/8" x 1/2") along the top surface of the manifold"........ They may be present on yours, but do not show in the photo.

Point2: Should be cad plated, although most platers today use zinc. Surface texture should be smooth. If they were media blasted before cad plating, the surface will be "stippled".

Point4: TIM&JG says "black", but means "black phosphate". Caswell sells a kit to plate black phosphate, but I can't vouch for the quality. I have had good luck using ordinary gun bluing to produce a good facsimile of black phosphate. The only thing missing is the crystalline glitter of true black phosphate. Some vendors sell "black phosphate" items, which are lacking this "crystalline glitter". The gun black works well, so long as you oil the blackened parts afterwards. Otherwise, flat black paint is better than cad plated, and, since ths JG says "black", some judges might let it go............at least at a Chapter Meet.

Point7: A.O. Smith body - cable and latches were installed after blackout. Cable should be natural steel.

Point8: I have never seen proportioning valves/metering blocks/connector blocks that are not brass.

Point9: ALL brake lines are unpainted natural steel.

Point10: Find or make a small spring, about 1"-2" long using fine wire, and insert it into the hose (same principle as used for fuel overflow hose, and lower radiator hose). Or, leave more slack in the hose bu pulling it upward from the pinch point below, between the splash guard and inner fender.

Point11: Difficult to tell from the picture, but if car was done in lacquer, or was done to APPEAR that it was done in lacquer ("lacquerthane"), then the jambs/gutters/door sills, etc, etc, should have a moderately low sheen, with characteristic fine/medium orange peel texture. There should be no paint buildup in corners, around bolt heads, rivet heads, etc. Lacquer "flashes" quickly, and does not flow like urethane or enamel paints do.

Joe

Thanks Joe. Just what I wanted. I hope you don't mind helping me go through these one by one.

1. What rectangular tabs would those be? Looking at the JG, are you referring to the tabs from the French locks on the end pair of manifold bolts?

2. They may be, although the flash of the camera makes them look better than they really do. They are the way they came with car when I bought it. I see from the JG they should be cadmium or zinc plated. Just assumed they were, but I will check.

3.Overspray missing from manifolds. Don't see that one in the JG, so do I assume it would be engine orange in my case? How much is expected?

4. Will see if they are painted as suggested in 2. Will order new ones of the proper make in needed. Can you "black phosphate" something?

5. Totally agree with that one cause I had to replace the fan that was on the car, a seven blade, with a five. Maybe one day I'll pick a correct one up and replace it.

6. I was pretty sure I had all the clamps correct on the AC system since I restored all the lines last year. Which ones are you referring to exactly, so that I can double-check.

7. A.O. Smith, so no blackout.

8. Just re-did the whole MC and booster (it too was painted black). I will see if I can clean off the black paint. Hopefully, it is brass underneath. If not does someone make a good replacement part?

9. By brake lines do you mean the ones running to and out of the proportioning valve? If so, I should be able to clean those up too.

10. Replaced that last year with the proper hose and it kinks. Not sure what to do as I have tried moving it around but it wants to stay kinked.

11. Help me out here - are the rain gutters the white pained "troughs" that run around the engine compartment area. I have be faithfully waxing them along with the rest of the car. So, are they suppose to be white, but not waxed and glossy?

Sorry, for all the follow-ups. But I really appreciate the help.

Kirk

[Gary S.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Here are some pics of the engine compartment of my 327/300hp with PS, PB, and AC. Give me your best NCRS critique! Thanks.

If you send me your email address, I will send you a bunch of close-up engine compartment pictures of a 67 300HP AC/PS/PB bowtie car you can use.
Gary (seymour@sosbbs.com)

[Alan S.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Hi Kirk,
I don't know enough to make even an UNINFORMED comment. (silence)
But, I DO love looking at photos of engine compartments and drive trains, so thanks for posting your photos.
Regards,
Alan

[Roy B.]

Re: Engine Compartment - Give Me Your NCRS Thoughts

Vary nice idea , I don't know about your Corvette, but that's a great idea because some people here know better then the JM what some design parts should look like. Good luck.