New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

[Dave S.]

On Saturday March 21st Dennis Lavallee has made his 1966 BB A/C Coupe and his shop in Uxbridge, Ma. available for a Chapter Judging school. This car was judged at the Farmington, Ct. Regional in 1993 and has been properly stored and untouched since. This school will allow the participants to re-judge the car under the current guidelines and judging sheets and then compare the results to those from 20+ years ago.
It should be an interesting and informative morning. Coffee and more at 9 AM with lunch served at noon.
The attached flyer will give you the details. We look foward to seeing you there.

[Larry M.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Dave:

I like it. Please post up the initial and final results when they become available.

Larry

[Richard M.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Dave, That sounds like a very appealing and fun event.

Ara G. has set up a similar session down here in Ft Lauderdale that I plan to attend on a '67 BB 2 weeks before yours on March 7th.

I wish I could attend yours too but a bit of a hike to get up there. It'd be fun to OJ with you again on Interior like I did at the National in Charlotte 2010. You taught me much about the Shark Cars then.

That '66 must be very special. For those of us that can't make it, do you have a plan to photograph or video any of the session? I'm sure many here would like to see photos of that '66 along with the comparison data.

Rich

[Dave S.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Dave, That sounds like a very appealing and fun event.

Ara G. has set up a similar session down here in Ft Lauderdale that I plan to attend on a '67 BB 2 weeks before yours on March 7th.

I wish I could attend yours too but a bit of a hike to get up there. It'd be fun to OJ with you again on Interior like I did at the National in Charlotte 2010. You taught me much about the Shark Cars then.

That '66 must be very special. For those of us that can't make it, do you have a plan to photograph or video any of the session? I'm sure many here would like to see photos of that '66 along with the comparison data.

Rich

Rich,
it should be interesting and informative. It's really not that far and you may want to return to your roots and view 60" of snow and 0 degree temps. Your suggestion about posting results and a few photos is a good one and we will do that. Video might be a stretch. The score from 1993 is a secret. 2010 is 4 1/2 years ago. Yikes.......stay warm

[Ara G.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Stricky,
That's pretty cool...Wish I was closer as well. You can always come down for mine - it would take some adjustment on your part as I promise we will NOT have any snow for you unless you go get a snow cone from a vendor....Sorry, I couldn't resist. In all honesty, I would love to attend. It's a good thing Rich and I don't have more spare time, as I am sure we'd jump in a car and head North for that weekend. Beers are on me, coffee is on Rich, and the BB is on you...Regards...Hope you are well. Good luck with this event. Missed seeing you and Bill at the Florida Regional (Bob was there though)....ARA

[Dave S.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Stricky,
That's pretty cool...Wish I was closer as well. You can always come down for mine - it would take some adjustment on your part as I promise we will NOT have any snow for you unless you go get a snow cone from a vendor....Sorry, I couldn't resist. In all honesty, I would love to attend. It's a good thing Rich and I don't have more spare time, as I am sure we'd jump in a car and head North for that weekend. Beers are on me, coffee is on Rich, and the BB is on you...Regards...Hope you are well. Good luck with this event. Missed seeing you and Bill at the Florida Regional (Bob was there though)....ARA

Ara,
20 more inches today. Florida is looking pretty good. Missed all of you in Lakeland as well but Family stuff comes first. Hopefully next year. As Rich suggested I'll post results and photos from our school. Best of Luck with your school which is two weeks prior and please give us all an update after you have it.

[Dave S.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Just a reminder to those New England and Mid Atlantic members about our March 21st judging school. It will be a 1 point event with complimentary coffee, donuts and lunch. We have seen very good interest so far and hope to get more. The details are on the NCRS home page under News and Events. Please email Dennis Lavallee or myself if you can attend. No formal online registration is needed.

[Dave S.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Just a reminder to those New England and Mid Atlantic members about our March 21st judging school. It will be a 1 point event with complimentary coffee, donuts and lunch. We have seen very good interest so far and hope to get more. The details are on the NCRS home page under News and Events. Please email Dennis Lavallee or myself if you can attend. No formal online registration is needed.

Looks like a good turnout. Mark your calendars. Hope to see you there.

[Dave S.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Looks like a good turnout. Mark your calendars. Hope to see you there.

I wanted to report back on the Judging School we had yesterday at Dennis Lavallee's Shop in Uxbridge, Ma.

First I want to thanks Dennis for opening his shop rto the membership and making his 66 BB A/C Coupe available for this great event. Also many thanks to Karen and Tony Blandini for organizing all the morning coffee etc and lunch.

Over 45 members attended the event. Tom Dingman made it all the way from Michigan via Connecticut, Tom Flanagan from Long Island, Bill Meise and Angelo Finateri from New York and others from 100 miles or more away. Special thanks to them for making the long drive to both attend and participate.

As stated the car was re-judged after being untouched from its 1993 Regional judging in Farmington, Ct. The process was very educational and interesting and without getting into to much detail the results can be summarized as follows;

1. In 1993 the paint recieved no deducts. This time it recieved an automatic 100% deduct because the door jambs etc. were not dulled. It appears to me that if the jambs etc. were dulled the car will get to a 20% deduct at worst and may get all the points the next time out as it is a real lacquer paint job. Net result was an 85 point deduct that did not occur 22 years ago due to paint guidelines that did not exist back then.
2. In 1993 the deducts were unclear about the sidepipes and somehow 40 points were deducted for what were add on sidepipes. This time the proper deductions were taken resulting in an 80 +/- point loss.
3. The car scored 2.3% (105 small points) lower this time. As you can see above 125 additional points were taken due to paint standards and proper sidepipe deductions so the remainder of the judging was within 20 points is 22 years ago. Pretty amazing.
4. In 1993 it seemed to me the there were a lot of 1 point deducts. With the advent of CCDIF and the "dot" approach we have corrected that problem of nickel and dime judging and the new score corrected that somewhat. Maybe 20 or more point difference.
5. Except for the above the general deducts were consistent both times.

Hopefully everyone enjoyed the event and learned something as well. If anyone has any further questions or comments feel free to contact me.

[Richard M.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Dave, Sounds like you all had a great session. Congrats!

Rich

[Tom D.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

I really enjoyed being "OJ" for the interior judging. Well worth the trip!

[Patrick H.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

1. In 1993 the paint received no deducts. This time it received an automatic 100% deduct because the door jambs etc. were not dulled. It appears to me that if the jambs etc. were dulled the car will get to a 20% deduct at worst and may get all the points the next time out as it is a real lacquer paint job. Net result was an 85 point deduct that did not occur 22 years ago due to paint guidelines that did not exist back then.

Whether Dave or anyone else, can this be explained a bit further with regard to this particular car?
Had the jambs, etc been polished after the initial paint so that they were excessively shiny or over restored? Was the paint over-restored in general with lack of the usual orange peel, etc?

I ask because some parts of my own original paint door jambs are quite shiny, and lacquer can even when untouched be very shiny at times. Generally I do not think that using the term "dulled down" is the correct description, as what we're looking for is the appearance (key word) of untouched lacquer. The factory didn't dull down any jambs, but they didn't do anything to improve their appearance either.

So, was the car untouched lacquer or was it over restored lacquer? I'm suspecting it's over-restored based on the comments above.

Thanks for any insight from those who have seen it.

Patrick

[Tom D.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

PH: This red paint job was quite a bit nicer than the factory finish on the new red 1967 convertible I looked at in Iowa City (back when I was supposed to be studying at the U. of Iowa library). On the '66, all visible areas of the door jambs were well covered with paint. (Except the screws holding the latches to the doors were not red.) All six side louvers, areas behind the rear wheels, bottom of the rear valence panel and the bottoms of the doors were all very well covered, and glossy.

Back to the new '67 I remember inspecting on the local Chevrolet dealer's showroom floor. It had no paint or almost no paint on the same lower body areas mentioned above. I don't specifically remember the door jambs on the car in Iowa, but I remember the surprise (and the significant let down) I felt back then.

[Dave S.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Whether Dave or anyone else, can this be explained a bit further with regard to this particular car?
Had the jambs, etc been polished after the initial paint so that they were excessively shiny or over restored? Was the paint over-restored in general with lack of the usual orange peel, etc?

I ask because some parts of my own original paint door jambs are quite shiny, and lacquer can even when untouched be very shiny at times. Generally I do not think that using the term "dulled down" is the correct description, as what we're looking for is the appearance (key word) of untouched lacquer. The factory didn't dull down any jambs, but they didn't do anything to improve their appearance either.

So, was the car untouched lacquer or was it over restored lacquer? I'm suspecting it's over-restored based on the comments above.

Thanks for any insight from those who have seen it.

Patrick

Patrick,
It is a lacquer red (non metallic) paint that was done to perfection everywhere including the door jambs, hood lip, lower part of the body, exhaust valence etc. and buffed throughout to a show quality including the jambs, lip etc. It is over applied and over restored lacquer. That was done in 1990 and looks great today. Back then the judging standards were not as clear as they are today so the paint passed the "then" standard. Today it is much better defined thus creating the total deduct. It was very obvious that the areas in question were very over restored. The two professional restorers at the meet felt the car could be prepared to receive a 20 percent deduction of 9 originality points by dulling, the jambs, hood lip, rear valence and lower body which would then allow all the condition points. Due to the 100 percent deduction at the school all the condition points were lost as well creating the 85 point loss.

[Patrick H.]

Re: New England Chapter Judging School - March 21st - Re-judge a 66 BB A/C Coupe

Thanks for the explanation, Dave. Sounds like today's deduction would be for over-restoration, which can be true no matter what type of paint is used.

Patrick