1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

[Michael H.]

I have a question about the early 1965 radio dials. The '65 Judging Guide states that "FM station indicators are red, and AM station indicators are green on early cars to approximately VIN 4300 at which time AM and FM indicators change to black." For the early '65's, is this referring to the letters or the entire window for the red/green? Is this reference in the JG essentially stating that the early '65 radio dials were configured identically to '64 radio dial? My research in the Archives here suggest a possibility that some 'early '65's had a black FM dial with white letters, which letters become red (FM) and Green (AM bottom) on the black background when the lights/radio are turned on. The latter configuration doesn't appear to be describing what the '65 JG specifies for early '65's, but it's somewhat unclear (at least to me). What about the Conelrad markers--were these on the early '65 dials? Thanks as always in advance.

[Wayne M.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

Michael --- I'm not entirely clear on this, myself. From the '65 TIM&JG, I think you're interpreting correctly about early '65s with the letters only illuminating red for FM and green for AM. Then, sometime in '65 MY (and also '66 and '67) they had green for both FM and AM, illuminating the letters . The green/green radio lens was from a radio that has the paper tag FSC-9134 and output transistor DS501 dated. 6540, so, from an early '66. The red/green radio lens in the 1st pic is from my early '65 #014xx, (can't guarantee if it's original) with tag FSA-2623 and the DS501 dated 435 [early Sept, 1964].

I have another 2 shots of a '64 (mid-8000 VIN) which has the red FM window and (what was before fading) a green AM window. I don't know how they would present new upon illumination (white letters on colored background ?). These two I'll put in a second post, as 5 pics exceeds the per-post limit.

[Ken R.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

The Sept., 2014 chapter newsletter from Western New York Chapter has an article on this very discussion, "CONELRAD Radios ....a tech question
By Tom Dingman". Web site has a copy, WNYNCRS.ORG under banner "News".

[Tom D.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

The Sept., 2014 chapter newsletter from Western New York Chapter has an article on this very discussion, "CONELRAD Radios ....a tech question
By Tom Dingman". Web site has a copy, WNYNCRS.ORG under banner "News".

My article asks for input on the timing of the removal of the two little round CONELRAD markers on the AM dial. I assume it happened when the "red and green" AM or FM markers (revealed by the "slider bar") changed to black for both AM and FM, in 1965 model year.

1. I did get feedback comment from someone with a '65 Corvette made way before number SN 4300. (The 1965 SN was 1xxx). It had a "later '65-67 style" radio, but the current owner cannot confirm this is the original radio.

2. I reviewed the archives of this discussion board as I composed the article. There's existing information about the color change. There's also mention of CONELRAD on the AM dial. However, since the feds. killed the CONELRAD system in August, 1963, I am looking for reasons why GM waited until 1965 to remove the two markers.

3. GM (and Delco division in Kokomo) probably didn't wait for all their various AM radios to change (away from CONELRAD) in all product lines. I am still looking for a 1964 GM radio without the CONELRAD markers. Real 1964 Corvette radios that I have looked at still have the markers at 640 and 1240 AM.

Write me at midvette@mac.com if you have a 1964 GM car without CONELRAD indicators. Write also if you have GM-Delco radio change notice details. Thanks!

[Tom D.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

I didn't really address Mr. Hooker's question in my article, or in the above submission. I don't have an answer at this point.

[Dan D.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

Try giving Jerry Rudbeck at Electro-Design a call. He is very knowledgeable on these old radios and has a lot of experience with them. There are plenty of threads on this forum about him.

-Dan-

[Michael H.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

Everyone, thanks for taking the time to reply. I have a very early '65 (second day of production), with what I believe is the original radio (but not the original dial, as discussed below). I deduce the originality of the radio based on the fact that it appeared never to have been removed from the car when I took it out. Also, the model number is for a '65 (986281), and the date derived from the rear D501 transistor is the middle of August '64, a couple of weeks before the car assembly date. When the front cover is removed, it shows the red and green plastic lens, which appear original and are identical to the ones that are shown in the photo that Wayne posted above from his early '65 radio.


Unfortunately, I had a radio restorer go through the radio and replace the original front cover, dial, and lens with repro parts that I bought from Corvette Central (and that were indicated to be correct for a '65). He replaced the original dial with this repro dial that does not have the Conelrad markings. He did not return the original parts, and regrettably I didn't take a photo that shows the dial before I sent it to him. So . . . I would have had the info that Tom and I seek if I had documented my radio before it was altered--i.e., I still don't know whether the original early '65 dial had Conelrad markings. By the way, the major Corvette repro houses all seem to carry three different mid-year radio "lens"--one for '63 and '64, another for '65, and yet another for '66 and '67. And they carry two radio "dial overlays with numbers"--one for '63 and '64, and a second for '65 to '67. (I surmise that the '63 and '64 dial is the one with the Conelrad indicators, and the later ones are obviously without those markings.)


In any event, I'm now pretty sure that the early '65 radios had the green and red plastic lens that illuminate when the radio and lights are on and that turn the AM and FM indicators green and red, respectively. I think the Judging Guide is ambiguous about this, and should be clarified in the next edition. I am also somewhat unclear about the reference in the JG about the AM and FM indicators changing to black in '65 after VIN 4300. Wayne and others seem to indicate that both the AM and FM indicators were green (not black) when illuminated in the '66 radios. I can't imagine that the mid to late '65 radio indicators were black and then changed to green in '66 (but who knows?) This scenario would have red and green AM/FM indicators in '64 and early '65, then both black in late '65, and then both green in '66??? Rather, I surmise that the mid to late '65 FM and AM indicators (after VIN 4300) were both green--like the '66 radio indicators-- and that the '65 JG is simply wrong (or at least very unclear) in this respect. But if someone knows for sure, inquiring minds want to know.


Wayne, thanks for your valuable input. Tom, thanks for writing the article. I think this is an area that, although admittedly arcane, needs to be cleared up.


Mike

[Wayne M.]

Re: 1964 Versus 1965 Radio Dial

Mike --- this has been an interesting thread; much more fun that talking about bolt head markings .

Here's the pics from a '64 radio I have, removed from a 086xx VIN car undergoing conversion to a resto-rod. Output transistor DS501 is dated 349 (1963, 49th week). Now I can see the reason the AM was faded by the sun (a convertible). The lens has AM and FM etched in white into the clear plastic. Kokomo plant stuck a peice of green or red tape (you can see the serrations where it was cut off from the dispenser) to the backside of the lens. So, IMHO, there was no translucency when the radio and lights were turned on.

First shot shows the faded AM and the Conelrad symbols.

So we're still asking for more members with early '65s (preferably unrestored) to turn on their parking lights and switch on the radio and report if FM is illuminated red or green, or is like the '64 shown here, and report back. No need to put your car on a hoist.